As the universal language of youth culture, music forms a common ground allowing the movement of fashion across the globe. New York fuses with Paris and London, and together they all travel through Tokyo (or some iteration of that anyway). Without question, music is the binding element in much of today’s “streetwear,” either in direct or indirect influence. Album cover inspired tees and looks ripped, sometimes literally, of the shoulders of megastars are transparent in musical connection. Beyond, a interest in music can inspire an aesthetic awakening. The sights that correspond with each sub-genre forming a visual catalog of style to be explored, mixed and matched. Sometimes this leads to the formation of a brand.
Just how that works is fascinating, so I got on the horn with Nick Jackson of 12 Bar to get a sense of it all. He was on his cell, and thanks to the magic of skype I was on my MacBook. - Nick Schonberger
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I’m particularly interested in how sound and music play out in visual arts and product design. I wondered if you could speak about how your interest in music has influenced the garments 12 Bar puts out.
Nick: I think that is one of those things where you have to look at the different products we produce to answer the question properly. The beauty of the graphic, and this is why the graphic tee will always be an integral part of what we do, is it allows you to directly represent your musical and other influences. For example, for Fall ‘08, we’ve done one design based on the color ways from the Midnight Marauders print. Obviously with that there is a direct correlation, and people can visualize it and get it straight away.
As far as the collection as a whole, I think the influence is a little more abstract. What I mean by that is its not so much, “oh, we’re going to make a coat that this guy wore in this video,” or something like that, which occasionally will happen. But, it’s more about the style we have, and the people in the company have. I think it’s largely born out of the style that emanated from each particular music genre. To give an example, we’ve done a chino pant for fall. It’s one of those things, that, growing up in London in the late 80s and early 90s with all the music people were listening to. Whether the jazz funk scene or American hip-hop or roots stuff, like Maceo Parker and Roy Ayers, you just developed a certain style and swagger. There were things that you wore that were almost just part of that time. Getting back to my point, we’ve made a chino pant that just makes sense to us, because in that era of time it’s what us and everybody around us were wearing. It almost went hand in hand with the music. People would wear argyle burlington socks, air Jordan's or timberland loafers, and they would wear puffa jackets. That was just the style of what we were into at the time, and what we were into really was born out of the music we were listening to, simple as that.
So you would say that music culture was your primary influence, rather than say the casual scene?
Nick: God, I’ve not heard the word casual in a long time. I think for us it was about the attitude and the style of the music we were into. What was interesting about growing up in London, and being fortunate enough to travel, particularly to the US a lot, was that London absorbed influences from the continent, particularly Paris, but also from New York and LA as well. Because the lines of communication were less dynamic back then, we could almost cherry-pick stuff. The whole New York hip-hop style, which was ridiculously baggy and very Polo influenced, Northface, really driven by that colder climate and that rugged look. In London, you would have looked ridiculous if you replicated that completely. So we would pull a few elements. Then we would pull a few elements from Paris as well. I think that it was really very music driven.
I remember going to Paris for 10 days in 1993, one of my friends was living out there, when people like MC Solaar were really big, and Menelik and Sony MC. That whole Talkin’ Loud, Urban Species sound was huge in London and Paris. I remember going there, and for the first time seeing people wear old school Nikes again and break dancing. Wearing Lacoste fisherman's hats and headbands, kind of like the whole Jimmy Conners tennis thing. In Paris, it was a nod back to New York breakin’ with a little European flavor. I came back to London rocking a pair of old school canvas Nikes, just one color with the swoosh, that cost about 20 quid. I came back, and people in England were like, “Damn, where did you get those, I’ve never seen them before.” Sure enough, they were in every Footlocker a few months later in London. It was just absorbing different elements, and that was what was so interesting about growing up in London in that period. The style was very much a reflection of the music.
I’m 30 now, but that’s kind of why I knew about Bape and Futura. I didn’t know about Futura from being fascinated by Graffiti, I knew about him because of Mo’ Wax. Then I discovered Subway Art, that had been sitting on my parents coffee table for years because they thought it was cool. While I don’t want to come across as corny like, “Oh yeah, music, we make a double breasted pea coat because Charlie Parker wore one.” It’s more about the style and attitude and how it influenced us in what we wore. I think in its simplest form it’s funny. I own Supreme clothes from 1995, and not because I was a skater. I was very interested in skate culture though, because I lived in Australia in the 80s, while the whole brigade thing was massive. That’s why I was always interested in Supreme. It was a skate brand, but it was very clean, fresh. Back then, a lot of the clothes had racial stereotypes.
Oh, absolutely.
Nick: That’s what I loved about Supreme. It wasn’t white or black or Asian or Indian or whatever. It was just very fresh, with a Polo aesthetic but very contemporary. It happened to be a skate brand. I think again, part of the London thing, was being able to pull a little bit of this and that. I wasn’t a skater, but I would pull elements of the culture I could associate with. I was never a rapper, or a DJ, I didn’t grow up in New York, but I would pull a few elements of that we liked. Similarly there was the whole underground rave that evolved into drum and bass, we could pull some stuff from that as well. I think all that is what helped guide the whole 12 Bar flavor. What’s been more interesting is that as the companies grown, there are eight of us full time now, we are literally all different ethnicities and from all walks of life. One of us grew up in Tokyo, one in New York, one in Honolulu, and everyone has there own flavor to bring to the table and make it even more rounded.
To go back to your blog, and the music. My own upbringing allowed me interaction with most of the things you’ve mentioned, but coming from the states to London, I was looking for something that sounded British. So, I was at Mudlumz jams. And, you’ve got the nylon caps that are very British to me. That nylon cap, so ubiquitous about scenes in the UK to me, is something I notice that rings a bell to me in your line.
Nick: It’s funny to me that you should mention Mudlumz, I was with some guys last week who were involved in that. Another thing that’s kind of weird, being an English guy in LA, the whole fitted thing doesn’t make sense to me. I understand its whole significance in America, how important it is, and how as a brand we need to do things with New Era (which we are), and some of the guys in the company love all that. For me, in a way, our hats are a nod to New York but with European slant. When I was young, I was really into Spike Lee. More than just his movies, some of which are I love and some of which I think were horrible, I was very much into him as an entrepreneur. He had the whole 40 Acres and a Mule clothing line, which is obviously one of those things, as a Jewish guy, that was very racially charged. From a branding perspective, I’ve always thought he was a genius. A lot of our caps are inspired by... I used to hate my hair when I was younger, I shaved my head when I was seventeen and have had the same haircut since. Prior to that I never knew what to do with my hair. It was a bit curly, but not really, so I just used to rock baseball caps. Some of my favorite caps were from 40 Acres and a Mule. Not so much the ones with the branding on it, but he did Mo’ Better Blues hats and Crooklyn hats. Every time I would go to New York, we would take a trip to Brooklyn and buy them. I just loved the shape of it. It was similar to a lot of the caps the Rude Boys would wear in London. So that’s wear that came from. Supreme have done very well with their five panel, but most people don’t make any hats apart from New Eras. We were like, lets do something that represents where all of us are coming from. That is were those caps come from.
That’s very interesting because it so represents the hats I see in London. Obviously you’ve got some circles, like you will never see Skinny Man without a New Era, and they are big in the grime scene.
Nick: Yeah, pretty interesting. I know in Grime, a lot of the kids are in the black New Eras. The Americanization trickles in bit by bit.
I was actually wondering if you liked any British rap, as the albums mentioned on the blog are Biggie or Jeru, a particular era in NY.
Nick: I mean, you know what’s funny, to me hip-hop is an American art form. I know that’s something me and you could talk about forever, but it is an American art form. That’s why, with trip-hop and drum and bass, and grime to a degree, what I love about all that is it is very British. When I heard British people trying to rap, save for a few exceptions that I’ll get onto, I felt they were just trying to be American. The voice of the streets and the vibe in London is very different. When things like Grime come out, and I was also into the soulful two-step, that is very London. Very real for that environment. It may not be as commercial, on a large scale, as hip-hop. People like Ms. Dynamite, before she went very pop, when she did all the stuff with Sticky, it’s so moody, London Rude Boy, Tottenham, Ladbroke Grove (which is where I’m from). I think that stuff is amazing. I do like a bit of British hip-hop. I used to like the London Posse. I thought they were very Ragga infused, which made it very British.
Rodney P is certainly one of the most British sounding rappers.
Nick: Exactly. I liked some of the Outlaw Posse, who were very underground but really associated themselves with the young disciples and the brand new heavies on that jazz thing. I was really into this, as you can tell from our website, we were very into Talking Loud. I love Urban Species. People like the Roots were first signed to Talking Loud, a lot of people don’t know that. That sort of stuff, I think great, but the best part of British music is when they are actually being British.
The opposite of the Channel U vibe.
Nick: Exactly. It doesn’t matter if it’s hip-hop, or rock or soul. People like Sade, very British, and it’s amazing because Sade wasn’t trying to be Whitney Houston, she was just a very soulful British person. That’s what she sounds like.
I’m really glad you like our blog. We were always tempted to do a who we know and how cool we are sort of thing. And, actually if you go back a few years we had a little foray into that. Then we were like, this is ridiculous, our roots are in music and let’s just do something that is actually about music. People love music. We are working on the blog know, and its actually going to have clips and sound bites on it. It’s constantly a work in progress. It is something that, weirdly, a lot of people are responding to. The older guys are saying things like, “Shit, I’ve not thought about Steely Dan in ages.” Younger guys find that Brand Nubian did something they didn’t know about. It is pretty nice, and for us it shows that were not what we aren’t. I think this whole music thing is becoming increasingly cool, and people are really associating themselves with music more and more, and you read this and it shows we know what we’re talking about.
